<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
</head>
<body>
<p>I guess a number of things might be happening to build the map,
then?</p>
<ol>
<li>Johnny's database gets queried for relevant data</li>
<li>A DECnet <font size="+1"><tt>NICE</tt></font> query is sent,
yet these data stores do not have complete information<br>
</li>
<li>
<style>
<!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:"Cambria Math";
panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;
mso-font-charset:0;
mso-generic-font-family:roman;
mso-font-pitch:variable;
mso-font-signature:-536870145 1107305727 0 0 415 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;
mso-font-charset:0;
mso-generic-font-family:swiss;
mso-font-pitch:variable;
mso-font-signature:-536859905 -1073697537 9 0 511 0;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{mso-style-unhide:no;
mso-style-qformat:yes;
mso-style-parent:"";
margin:0in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
mso-pagination:widow-orphan;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;
mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";}
.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;
mso-default-props:yes;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri;
mso-ascii-theme-font:minor-latin;
mso-fareast-font-family:Calibri;
mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-latin;
mso-hansi-font-family:Calibri;
mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin;
mso-bidi-font-family:Arial;
mso-bidi-theme-font:minor-bidi;}size:8.5in 11.0in;
margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;
mso-header-margin:.5in;
mso-footer-margin:.5in;
mso-paper-source:0;}
div.WordSection1
{page:WordSection1;}</style>SNMP query</li>
</ol>
<p>I'm asking this for two reasons.</p>
<p>First, Tops-20 doesn't currently support SNMP. However, I had
actually architected an SNMP server a few years ago; it would grab
various bits of information via GETAB%, CNFIG% and maybe Galaxy,
but would have been Read-Only. Investigating a few things I had
discerned from Windows and some embedded devices (Linksys routers
and some HP print servers) as well as reviewing some RFC's, it
didn't seem to be that heavy a lift.<br>
</p>
<p>I never implemented it because I didn't have any cool management
software to read all of it and display it. I believe the only
stuff I was aware of were commercial offerings (perhaps Tivoli,
which means "Bring Your Wallet"). Maybe there is something now.
Also, Orion implements a remote (DECnet only) interface for most
relevant management (except shutdown); this could be trivially
expanded to handle TCP/IP. There was also the matter of security
for setting items; I'm barely started implementing cryptography on
the 20.</p>
<p>Second, some issues with MAIL-11 and DECnet SMTP on Tops-20 have
caused me to believe that one solution would be to expand the DNS
service (CHIVES) to handle A and MX records for DECnet. That's
not actually that big a stretch; the DNS specification has 16 bit
data types for CHAOS, which would be trivially re-usable for Phase
IV DECnet. However, I'm finding the current documentation to be a
chore to wade through. The source code incomplete in certain
functionality.<br>
</p>
<p>Assuming I get this figured out, what I would do is modify SETNOD
to parse a fuller version of Johnny's database. In addition to
building the binary file for importation into Tops-20's DECnet
node name hash table, it would also build a binary TBLUK% table
for use by COMND% instead of .CMNOD and also a zone file that
CHIVES could parse for the DNS records.</p>
<p>Right now, I'm working on SETHOST, which is a client for the
earlier NRT protocol (Network Remote Terminal) that predates CTERM
on the 36 bit platform. It's more efficient than CTERM (I have
yet to compare it with LAT) and will do certain things that I like
that the Tops-20 implementation of CTERM doesn't.<br>
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:BABEB3F2-8E2F-47E7-914F-2731900388AF@comcast.net">
<hr width="100%" size="2">
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">On 5/4/20 1:39 PM, Paul Koning wrote:
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:BABEB3F2-8E2F-47E7-914F-2731900388AF@comcast.net"> </blockquote>
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">Nice idea. I can certainly do this. To make it work, the node database would have to list IP addresses for MIB access.
The fact that the Cisco routers don't speak NICE isn't always a problem. If they have neighbors that do I still get the information, since I will chart a circuit even if only one of the two sides tells me about it.
If there is a chain of Cisco routers, the one in the middle of the chain wouldn't be mapped. But, for example, an area served by a Cisco area router would be, since the mapper will try to talk to the nodes in the area and ask them what their view of the neighborhood looks like.
If all I did was a recursive graph walk the Cisco issue would be serious, but that's not what the code actually does. A closer approximation is a "bulk mail" query sent to every node in Johnny's database.
paul
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<hr width="100%" size="2">
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap=""><pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">On May 4, 2020, at 1:35 AM, Tim Sneddon <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:tim@sneddon.id.au"><tim@sneddon.id.au></a> wrote:<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">I would definitely be up for that. Maybe "hecnet-ro" for the community name?
</pre>Regards, Tim.
<blockquote type="cite"><hr width="100%" size="2"><pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap=""><pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">On Mon, May 4, 2020 at 1:57 AM Peter Lothberg <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:roll@stupi.com"><roll@stupi.com></a> wrote:
</pre>The Cisco DECnet router implementation does not speak "decnet management" as we all knew. The way we are using them the tunnel end-points are on the Internet.
Most of the information "missing" is actually available through the SNMP MIB, so if we could agree on a common read-only community and publish the IP addresses of those routers it would be possible to complete Paul's map..
</pre></blockquote></pre></pre>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</body>
</html>