[HECnet] RSTS/E 10.1 BASIC-2-PLUS problem

[Johnny Billquist]

Glad to hear that solved it.

I asked already from the start if it was BASIC+ or BASIC+2, because the 
difference is important.

And it really is BASIC+2, and not BASIC2+. :-)

As for why your installation happened that way, I have no clue. Did you 
install from the distribution tapes yourself, or is this some image 
someone else created and you got a copy from?

And did you use the proper installation tools, or did you extract files 
yourself from the tape and placed in various directories?

   Johnny

On 2018-09-17 20:05, Keith Halewood wrote:
> Thanks Johnny,
> 
> It’s [1,2]bp2rfa.hlp and its protection was 48. I’ve set it to 40 and a 
> non-privileged, non [1,*] account can now see help in the basic-2-plus env.
> 
> The whole RSTS/E V10.1 and BASIC-2-PLUS installations are entirely 
> default. Apart from adding DECNET/E and enabling LAT etc., nothing else 
> should be other than default.
> 
> Weird.
> 
> Thanks again
> 
> Keith
> 
> *From:*owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] *On 
> Behalf Of *Johnny Billquist
> *Sent:* 17 September 2018 18:36
> *To:* hecnet at Update.UU.SE; Paul Koning <paulkoning at comcast.net>
> *Subject:* Re: [HECnet] RSTS/E 10.1 BASIC-2-PLUS problem
> 
> All that said - if the op is actually using basic+2 then help is a 
> builtin command in the interactive environment. Furthermore the basic+2 
> builtin help uses an extra file for fast lookups into the help file, so 
> this additional file could also be the problem.
> 
> I'd need to check when I'm back home what the exact name of this file 
> is, but something like bp2hlp.rfa maybe?
> 
> Johnny
> 
> Paul Koning <paulkoning at comcast.net <mailto:paulkoning at comcast.net>> 
> skrev: (17 september 2018 16:38:37 CEST)
> 
>     Command processing in RSTS depends on which runtime system (more precisely, "keyboard monitor") you're currently in.
> 
>     If you're in DCL, standard DCL commands (like "copy") are understood.  "help" is another standard DCL command.
> 
>     In most other runtime systems, like BASIC, there are a few built-in commands that relate more to the purpose of that runtime system (like "SAVE" or "OLD").
> 
>     In addition, keyboard monitors normally understand any of the defined "system commands" -- also called "CCL commands".   Those are commands defined via the create command/system DCL operation, and you can see them with show command/system.  For example:
> 
>     $ show com/sys
>     BCK-       =  SY:[  0,10 ]RMSBCK.TSK /LINE=0
>     BYE-       =  SY:[  1,2  ]LOGOUT.TSK /LINE=0    /PRIVILEGE
>     CNV-       =  SY:[  0,10 ]RMSCNV.TSK /LINE=0
>     DI-RECTORY =  SY:[  1,2  ]DIRECT.TSK /LINE=CCL  /PRIVILEGE
>     ...
> 
>     In my system, "help" is not shown there, so while DCL knows it, other RTS would not.  If your system does respond to it, what is the command definition?
> 
>     As for [0,2]help.tsk, that's a strange protection code.  Mine has <104> and I can see no reason why that program should be privileged.
> 
>            paul
> 
>         On Sep 17, 2018, at 10:30 AM, Keith Halewood <Keith.Halewood at pitbulluk.org <mailto:Keith.Halewood at pitbulluk.org>> wrote:
> 
>         Hi Paul,
>           
>         Thanks for the info. Other than help.hlp, there is only help.tsk in [0,2] and it has protection <232> (privileged, execute, world readonly, group+owner read/write)
>         After a backup, I’ll do some further experimentation.
>           
>         Regards
>           
>         Keith
>           
>         From:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE <mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE>  [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Paul Koning
>         Sent: 17 September 2018 14:01
>         To:hecnet at Update.UU.SE <mailto:hecnet at Update.UU.SE>
>         Subject: Re: [HECnet] RSTS/E 10.1 BASIC-2-PLUS problem
>           
>           
> 
> 
>         On Sep 14, 2018, at 5:26 PM, Keith Halewood <Keith.Halewood at pitbulluk.org <mailto:Keith.Halewood at pitbulluk.org>> wrote:
>           
>         Hi,
>           
>         I’ve been playing with RSTS/E for a short while, particularly BASIC PLUS. I’ve noted that, logged into account [1,2] I can issue HELP from within BASIC and it’s all fine. From a non-privileged account I created, HELP within BASIC gives me a ‘?Protection violation’ but it seems that all the .HLP files relevant to BASIC have the correct <40> file protection. Am I missing something? Any help would be appreciated.
>           
>         Regards,
>           
>         Keith
>           
>         "help" is most likely a CCL command -- a command defined, typically at startup, that is handled by executing a program.
>           
>         You're right that the actual content in in the *.hlp files, and they need to be protected <40> for that to work.  But in addition, the program that handles the command has to be executable by non-privileged users.  So look in [0,*] or [1,2] for a help.* file (help.tsk, help.bac, help.sav perhaps).  It has to be executable (64 bit set in the protection code).  So a typical protection code would be 104.
>           
>                      paul
> 
> 
> -- 
> Skickat från min Android-enhet med K-9 Mail. Ursäkta min fåordighet.
> 

-- 
Johnny Billquist                  || "I'm on a bus
                                   ||  on a psychedelic trip
email: bqt at softjar.se             ||  Reading murder books
pdp is alive!                     ||  tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol