[HECnet] RSTS/E 10.1 BASIC-2-PLUS problem

[Keith Halewood]

Thanks Steve,

Having a look around now.
I've not been able to install Fortran-77 locally possibly due to a mangled tape image.

Keith

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Steve Davidson
Sent: 17 September 2018 19:18
To: hecnet at Update.UU.SE
Subject: Re: [HECnet] RSTS/E 10.1 BASIC-2-PLUS problem

You are welcome to login to Pluto::[200,200] to compare systems. 

-Steve

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 17, 2018, at 14:10, Johnny Billquist <bqt at softjar.se> wrote:
> 
> Glad to hear that solved it.
> 
> I asked already from the start if it was BASIC+ or BASIC+2, because the difference is important.
> 
> And it really is BASIC+2, and not BASIC2+. :-)
> 
> As for why your installation happened that way, I have no clue. Did you install from the distribution tapes yourself, or is this some image someone else created and you got a copy from?
> 
> And did you use the proper installation tools, or did you extract files yourself from the tape and placed in various directories?
> 
>  Johnny
> 
>> On 2018-09-17 20:05, Keith Halewood wrote:
>> Thanks Johnny,
>> It’s [1,2]bp2rfa.hlp and its protection was 48. I’ve set it to 40 and a non-privileged, non [1,*] account can now see help in the basic-2-plus env.
>> The whole RSTS/E V10.1 and BASIC-2-PLUS installations are entirely default. Apart from adding DECNET/E and enabling LAT etc., nothing else should be other than default.
>> Weird.
>> Thanks again
>> Keith
>> *From:*owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] 
>> *On Behalf Of *Johnny Billquist
>> *Sent:* 17 September 2018 18:36
>> *To:* hecnet at Update.UU.SE; Paul Koning <paulkoning at comcast.net>
>> *Subject:* Re: [HECnet] RSTS/E 10.1 BASIC-2-PLUS problem All that 
>> said - if the op is actually using basic+2 then help is a builtin command in the interactive environment. Furthermore the basic+2 builtin help uses an extra file for fast lookups into the help file, so this additional file could also be the problem.
>> I'd need to check when I'm back home what the exact name of this file is, but something like bp2hlp.rfa maybe?
>> Johnny
>> Paul Koning <paulkoning at comcast.net <mailto:paulkoning at comcast.net>> skrev: (17 september 2018 16:38:37 CEST)
>>    Command processing in RSTS depends on which runtime system (more precisely, "keyboard monitor") you're currently in.
>>    If you're in DCL, standard DCL commands (like "copy") are understood.  "help" is another standard DCL command.
>>    In most other runtime systems, like BASIC, there are a few built-in commands that relate more to the purpose of that runtime system (like "SAVE" or "OLD").
>>    In addition, keyboard monitors normally understand any of the defined "system commands" -- also called "CCL commands".   Those are commands defined via the create command/system DCL operation, and you can see them with show command/system.  For example:
>>    $ show com/sys
>>    BCK-       =  SY:[  0,10 ]RMSBCK.TSK /LINE=0
>>    BYE-       =  SY:[  1,2  ]LOGOUT.TSK /LINE=0    /PRIVILEGE
>>    CNV-       =  SY:[  0,10 ]RMSCNV.TSK /LINE=0
>>    DI-RECTORY =  SY:[  1,2  ]DIRECT.TSK /LINE=CCL  /PRIVILEGE
>>    ...
>>    In my system, "help" is not shown there, so while DCL knows it, other RTS would not.  If your system does respond to it, what is the command definition?
>>    As for [0,2]help.tsk, that's a strange protection code.  Mine has <104> and I can see no reason why that program should be privileged.
>>           paul
>>        On Sep 17, 2018, at 10:30 AM, Keith Halewood <Keith.Halewood at pitbulluk.org <mailto:Keith.Halewood at pitbulluk.org>> wrote:
>>        Hi Paul,
>>                  Thanks for the info. Other than help.hlp, there is only help.tsk in [0,2] and it has protection <232> (privileged, execute, world readonly, group+owner read/write)
>>        After a backup, I’ll do some further experimentation.
>>                  Regards
>>                  Keith
>>                  From:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE <mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE>  [mailto:owner-hecnet at Update.UU.SE] On Behalf Of Paul Koning
>>        Sent: 17 September 2018 14:01
>>        To:hecnet at Update.UU.SE <mailto:hecnet at Update.UU.SE>
>>        Subject: Re: [HECnet] RSTS/E 10.1 BASIC-2-PLUS problem
>>                            On Sep 14, 2018, at 5:26 PM, Keith Halewood <Keith.Halewood at pitbulluk.org <mailto:Keith.Halewood at pitbulluk.org>> wrote:
>>                  Hi,
>>                  I’ve been playing with RSTS/E for a short while, particularly BASIC PLUS. I’ve noted that, logged into account [1,2] I can issue HELP from within BASIC and it’s all fine. From a non-privileged account I created, HELP within BASIC gives me a ‘?Protection violation’ but it seems that all the .HLP files relevant to BASIC have the correct <40> file protection. Am I missing something? Any help would be appreciated.
>>                  Regards,
>>                  Keith
>>                  "help" is most likely a CCL command -- a command defined, typically at startup, that is handled by executing a program.
>>                  You're right that the actual content in in the *.hlp files, and they need to be protected <40> for that to work.  But in addition, the program that handles the command has to be executable by non-privileged users.  So look in [0,*] or [1,2] for a help.* file (help.tsk, help.bac, help.sav perhaps).  It has to be executable (64 bit set in the protection code).  So a typical protection code would be 104.
>>                               paul
>> --
>> Skickat från min Android-enhet med K-9 Mail. Ursäkta min fåordighet.
> 
> -- 
> Johnny Billquist                  || "I'm on a bus
>                                  ||  on a psychedelic trip
> email: bqt at softjar.se             ||  Reading murder books
> pdp is alive!                     ||  tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol